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There is an interesting line of thought which claims the possibility that eanderthals inter-mated with cro-magnons forming the current incarnation of homo-habilus and from there homo-sapien.
One this is for sure, neanderthals disappear at some point in history, whether the tribe died out because they were socially primitive, or whether they bred with cro-magnon and became a united species is the real question.

I don't think there is a direct line from Neanderthal to Homo-sapien though, not without a few stops in the middle.

Nope. They’re dead. We were around at the same time. We won, they lost. And we were a different branch of Homo erectus.

ROTFALMAO!

"First there was Adam and Eve and they had two sons, Cain and Abel. Cain slew Abel in a fit of jealousy and then left home and got himself a wife."

I have always wondered just where Cain's wife came from.

Maybe Lord Tiberivs or Sal or Jared can tell me.

Furthermore, I really don't give a rip! Why? Because it just doesn't matter in the long run, that's why!

Just my not-so-humble opinion. B)

Sometime after the modern humans began to roam the earth, the Neanderthals disappeared and no one knows the reason why.

What is so funny?

duh papadawg, God magicked her into existence. I thought everyone knew that. Once Adam and Eve left the Garden of Blissful Ignorance, God populated a world full of evil heretics and forced them out into it. But most of them were communists so the bible doesn't really mention them!

That you think that humans originated only in Africa and that you think Neanderthals were not human.

Your ignorance is hilarious!

Thousands of scientists in the field believe that. What do you think I made up my own hypothesis?

Last time I checked you are a retired policeman, not a scientist.

According to my anthropology professor, Neanderthals were a species of Homo Erectus. Homo meaning Human. Erectus meaning standing up.

No, I am not a scientist. No I am not retired from law enforcement. I just stopped being a cop about ten years ago – five years before being eligible for retirement. I am a retired United States Marine.

From my years as a cop I know that there is a certain species of Neanderthal that still exist today – I have arrested an awful lot of them.

On a more serious side, there is a growing school of thought that Homo Sapiens is not indigenous to Planet Earth. What do you think?

Papadawg – I'm sorry if I offended you, honestly. It just seems like you are so angry at the world from the type of people that you have seen in your career experiences.

This fact appears to skew your view about a lot of different topics. Just think about it.

As for the Homo Sapiens question, I believe we are from Planet Earth.

I have always wondered how long it took multiple life forms to evolve of the same type. Wouldn't the first have died off long before the second crawled out? Or did it asexually reproduce? And if so, then how did we make the transition?

Either way- somewhere along the way, somebody had to mate with their sister. ^.^

So what do you actually believe? God took the dirt of the Earth and formed man in his own image? The place man in a deep sleep and created woman from man's rib? Do you believe man was created fully formed a mere several thousand years ago? What is your stance on the thousands of fossil recovered from layers of Earth that haven't seen daylight for millions of years? What is your belief regarding dinosaurs? Is all of this stuff fake for you? Do you look at fossilized remains and think to yourself, "thats not real…. God put that there as a test for the faithful….."

I really want to know where creationists get the proof for their stories….

Homo Erectus sounds like a bad disease.

Well I don't believe in evolution period, so it doesn't matter one way or t'other to me.

First of all- I believe creation as a matter of faith. It does not have to make sense to you. I don't fully understand it. But I still believe it happened.

Yes, I believe God created man six thousand years ago. However, I believe there is a gap between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2. That means that yes, the Earth could be millions of years old- the Earth meaning the rocks, dirt, etc.

During Noah's flood (another event that is a source of much debate), the entire world got shook up due to the water that was there. During this time, fossils (which are created in an instant's time, not over thousands of years) were made within the layers of rock.

In the end, I believe what I believe and you'll just have to live with that.

I can live with whatever you believe Liberty, but my point is that evolution has scientific evidence to back up it's theories. Creationism does not. I just want to know where your proof of faith comes from.

Comprimising your faith Liberty? Why is that? Perhaps you are trying to satisfy everyone. The bible says days not millions of years.

Also yes, a worldwide flood can prove the grand canyon, and the fossils are in the rocks. It happened in a matter of days, not millions of years. While their is no proof of this, there are legends of worldwide floods from literally, every single civilization in exsistence. Where is evolutions proof that, lets says, the grand canyon took millions of years to carve?

In Biblical times age was counted by the phases of the moon, then supplemented by the seasons in the parts of the planet that had discernible seasons. Primitive men back then did not read nor write – only the religious scholars did.

Also, since God is an unseen entity, we do not know how long God's day is.

Modern theology teaches that God created the Universe in his own time.

I do not attend church, nor do I belong to a organized religion, but that does not mean that I do not believe in God. During my time in war (Viet Nam) I met a lot of so-called atheists. Strangely enough, after their first firefight they were not atheists anymore.

FYI – Believing in God is not a religion. Not believing in the writings of the Bible does not make one an atheist.

As I write this, freedom of religion is still a fact in the USA.

There are actually many scientists (Harvard and other Ivy League grads) who have done reasearch into creationism, and have uncovered proof that we may have come from a higher power.

I don't think I am compromising my faith. I just think that it is an explanation for the reason that we can see the lights of stars that are millions of lightyears away, or why th rocks are as old as they are. Besides, even my beliefs can't make everyone happy.

Are you serious. Science has proven the grand canyon was dug by the Colorado river over the last 18 million years. No a flood cannot prove the grand canyon. According to the bible that flood lasted a number of weeks. A few months of water cannot erode a 6000ft, 6 mile long hole in the ground. It can't, it doesn't. Furthermore, the Canyon exposes over 2 billion years worth of rock strata along the course of it's depth. Where do you even get your information from?

Where is my proof? The fact that the friggin river is still carving the canyon deeper every minute of every day is undeniable undeniable proof.

Of course it is now, but it got a boast when it was covered entirely with water. I miss your actual scientific explanations to my questions LordTiberivs, instead you have simply told me that it didn’t happen, I’m confused, I thought that science had real explanations. Please give me something I can think about.

God wrote the bible in respect to the humans knowledge at the time of it was written, hence Galelileo’s problem. God was aware of how long human days were, do you forget that God is omnipotent? Yes you are comprimising you’re faith, you are saying that the bible is incorrect, that is comprimising your faith, it’s simple.

My proof was specifically in the fact that the river is continually eroding the canyon deeper. The depth of change is measurable along the course of years. Taking the amount of time it takes to dig a further foot, or a further year you can calculate the amount of time it took for the river to dig the canyon totally. This come out to millions of years, not several days.

Now, considering there is empirical proof of the rivers cutting the canyon, and it is measurable on a year to year basis; and that this is the second time I've answered this question to you, I say: Where is your proof of a world wide flood? Where is your proof that this flood covered the world, and for a few "days"? Where did this water come from so quickly?…. where did it disappear to even quicker? Can you answer any of those questions?

So yes, I can prove the canyon was dug over millions of years, whereas you have already admitted that there is no proof of a world wide flood…. just "legendary stories"…..

A few months of water….that covered the entire planet. Over the mountains. Mount Everest was covered. Now, I don't know all the science behind it. Science is not my strong point. ^.^ But since I do not think the Earth as we know it has existed for 18 million years, I cannot say that the canyon was caused by slow erosion of that type.

The flood waters were on the Earth, according to the Biblical account, for over a year and a half, over which time they evaporated.

Also, once again you are forgetting the volume of fast-moving water we are talking about. That is a LOT of water. Not a river, not even a flood as we know it. Think of a gigantic tidal wave the size of Everest bearing down on the Earth. All around the Earth. All at the same time.

There is no real proof of it except the stories. Because that's the only form of recording the ancients were capable of. Did you expect them to leave us scientific logs and CDs to record it complete with video tapes and sound tracks?

As you yourself have stated, erosion occurs. Yes, the grand canyon is still being eroded. But just because it is being eroded NOW does not mean it was eroded in the same way years ago.

Think of it this way. A man is in a wheelchair. But just because he is in that wheelchair NOW does not mean he was in that wheelchair millenia ago.

That amount of water does not "evaporate" without going somewhere. Water does not evaporate and disappear from this planet, is condenses into cloud masses, increases density and falls back to earth in the form of rain precipitation. Every molecule of water that exists now has always existed on Earth in the form of water, humidity, ice, or vapor. Your ficticious flood cannot evaporate into nothing, it must be accounted for, and if it still existed it would still cover the land masses.

Your analogy of the wheelchair is incomparable to amounts of matter in a closed system like the planet. All matter on this planet that was here, is still here in one form or another. Less the small amounts we have blasted off into space in the last 50 years.

Also, doing some quick math using the formula for volumetric calculation of a sphere (4/3)(pi)r^3. Using the height of Mt Everest as a marker(since you claim it was covered). Comes to a volume of 1.027 quadrillion cubic feet of water. That's 1027 trillion cubic feet of water that you claim disappeared. FYI that's 768,559,110,021,554 gal(US Liq) ok… 770 trillion gallons… of water…. evaporated… in 18 months….. Get real guys, you're being so narrow minded it's amazing!

Evidently evolution must matter to everyone here somewhat, or presumably you wouldn't spend your time arguing about it. That said…
Neanderthals were not so primitive, compared to their contemporaries in Ice Age Europe. They buried their dead, for one thing, which most human ancestors up to that point did not. They also created musical instruments, and showed evidence of lifelong attachments to family. There's actually no way to determine if they were or weren't our ancestors, with our current evidence. But here's a bit of modern anthropology for you to consider.
Let's say you're from New York City, which is roughly at sea level. You fall in love with someone in Denver, Colorado, 5,000 feet above sea level, and move there. You experience altitude breathing trouble for the rest of your life. Your kids, though, won't. They'll meld your best traits (your savvy NYC fashion sense, perhaps, or your childbearing hips) with those of your spouse (in this case, the ability to breathe easily so far above sea level). In a few generations, no one will be able to find a trace of your low altitude lung weakness in your descendants.
Any unnecessary Neanderthal traits (shorter stature, extra hair for colder climates, etc) would have been bred out in a generation or two of interbreeding with Cro-Magnon. Most of the 'Neanderthals can't be related to humans' assertions spring from the desire of racist armchair anthropologists to distance themselves from anything they deem to be too short, too hairy, or too dark skinned. We don't know if they were sexually compatible with Cro-Magnon or not.
But you can't really debate the inherent issues of anthropology (racism, empirical evidence, sources of information) if you're asserting that evolution, Neanderthals, australopithecines, and millions of years of human history are just crazy speculation.

That water is still with us today. A theory of a scientist that I know is that their was a layer of water above the earths atmosphere that made the air density greater, thus explaining the gigantic humans animals and plants that we have found today. At the time of the flood this blanket descended on an earth that primarily all land mass. The fountains of the deep also broke open as the bible states creating a mass flood. Afterwards some of the water evaporated but most of it is in our oceans that were not their before the flood, and I suppose some may have gone underground as well. Remember it is a theory, and I don’t have all the details on it.

^This. ^.^

what does that mean Liberty?

So you have no details, or evidence, or mathematical calculations. What you do have is a story by "some scientist" you know. This isn't a theory pusty. Theories must be supported by some evidence. Once again, you are giving me no evidence to work with. Nothing I can try and corroborate… You've given me another story….. yawn

What are you referencing to?

The so called “story” I told in response to you asking the question, where did all the water go. Yes I realize that I can’t prove it or disprove it. But it makes sense to me, the air density allowed for humans to live longer and be stronger, as well as animals, hence dinosaurs. Then this layer of water was brought down by, let’s say, God. World-wide flood, and the destruction of mankind etc. You get it.

Let me ask you that if the Colorado River did carve the Grand Canyon how is there no leftover sedimentary deposits, also the top of Grand Canyon is 4,000 feet higher than where the Colorado river enters the Canyon, how could the river flow uphill for millions of years?

Also according to the bible, before the flood the earth was flat without mountains and valleys. (Gen. 8:3-8 Ps. 104:5-9). If this is true than in the ocean alone there is enough water to cover the earth 8,000 feet deep. Also to consider is that the top 3,000 feet of Mt. Everest are made of sedimentary rock that is packed by seashells and other aquatic animals. Including petrified clams (found throughout the world) in the closed position, thus suggesting that they were all buried rapidly. And why is there sedimentary rock all over the world. (sedimentary rock is formed in water)

Firstly, no, air density has nothing to do with animal size or life span. Check out the dimetrodon it was one of the first "dinosaurs" and it didn't start out so large. Dinosaurs grew so big because there was nothing to stop their rate of growth as they evolved.

Secondly, no again, the Grand Canyon top is not 4000 feet higher than it's source. The head waters of the Colorado river starts in the Rocky Mountains at an elevation of 9000' above sea level when it reaches the Canyon it is still 2800' above sea level, it then finishes at the border of Cali/Ariz/Mexico where it is still 100' above sea level… it's ALWAYS flowing down hill. Do you research before you answer

The simple answer is "plate tectonics" Mt. Everest, as are all mountains in the world are situated at the interlock of two continental plates. As the plates grind up against each other they cause huge ridges of upturned rock which eventually grow so high they are mountains. These ridges were in many cases the sea bed of ancient lakes/seas/oceans. The living strata was upturned along with the rock. Why are they closed? There is plenty of movement and disturbance in many cases of these events, many sea animals are covered and quickly. This isn't even evolution… it's basic geology, it's like freshman year college Earth Science…..

There is a spot in Eurasia where Homo sapiens and Home neandertahlensis coexisted for several thousand years, and there isn't any evidence of interbreeding. These were "Cousin" species, neanderthals were related, but not in our lineage. Both apparently decended from Homo habilis.

But how does that prove sedimentary rock that isn’t formed along mountains? No you misunderstand, the Colorado river is not currently flowing backwards, if the river did erode all the rock a few million years ago it would’ve had to flow uphill 4,000 feet from its source to cut rock deep enough to flow downhill, obviously this is not possible.

Yes plate tectonics are the answer to the seashells question. When the flood happened the mountains rose and the valleys sunk, in a very short time.

Lastly yes, higher air density does amazing things. Have you ever heard of a Hyperbaric chamber? It is used as medicine to heal people, when plants are grown in it they turn out to be in monstrous proportions. About the dimetrodon, it may be just a monstrous salamder to our standards, as reptiles grow their whole lives.

Ok firstly, still no on the Colorado river, even if the canyon wasn't there yet, the source of the river headwaters in the Rockies is still a higher elevation than the ground level of the canyon, less the ditch. So it's never flowing up-river to cut the canyon.

secondly, I totally disagree with your time line of this flood and its fast appearance and faster disappearance, and considering that I have listed mountains (haha) of evidence while you have listed nothing but stories and fables, I'm just going to chalk this up to you not wanting to even consider the scientific side of the argument, and I'll quit wasting my own time on it.

Thirdly, plants do not grow amazingly large due to hyperbaric chambers. Hyperbaric chambers heal people due to a 100% oxygen environment. Plants if you recall elementary school thrive on CO2 which they in turn metabolize into O2 (oxygen) for the people of the world, they even do it for free.

Pusty, you are the perfect example of how a little bit of knowledge can be a dangerous thing.

Thanks for restating Sal comment!

No, you still don’t understand that the place where it enters the canyon is not the rockies, it enters the north rim of the canyon at 2800 feet above sea level. But the highest point of the Grand Canyon is 4,000 feet. If it had eroded that canyon it would’ve had to go uphill to reach it. Please research before you make arguements that contradict gravity.

How do mountains prove that the flood didn’t happen? Mass amounts of water can move mountains with ease. Maybe I missed your actual scientific explanation, so I will ask how do mountains prove that the flood happened, just because they exist that doesn’t rule out the flood.

I do not have the examples myslef and maybe I’ll find them, but I have seen them myself the gigantic plants from hyberbaric chambers. Just wondering, how does evolution explain the gigantic humans, animals, and plants that we are unearthing?

Your last statement is what really puzzles me. Lord Tiberivs, how is asking questions and challenging theories dangerous? Please explain how I am such a danger to everyone if I am simply mentioning problems with evolution. How do you think your friend Darwin became such a hero?

You are dangerous with your small amount of knowledge because you show no examples, you give no evidence. You mindlessly cling to the small amount of knowledge you have and insistently spew it out constantly in the hopes someone will rally to your cause. You don't ask questions that challenge theories. You merely state an unsupportable standpoint.

YOU don't understand pusty, I'm not saying the Rockies are where the river enters the canyon! I stated at least three other times, where you also didn't listen, the HEADWATERS (where the river begins) is in the rockies, at an elevation of 9000'. 9000 feet above sea level, none of my arguments counteract gravity, all my arguments support gravity, I provided elevation data, I provide erosion data. I provide methods for examining depth of erosion vs time. I provide reasonable explanations which you make no attempt to examine. You merely restate your unsupported point. I'm sorry pusty but you are wrong. You are too close minded to even research my answers.

I went and looked for evidence of hyperbaric plant growth after you made you comment. I found none. What I did find was quite alot of sites stating that the all oxygen environment of HB chambers was a poor environment for growing plants. I researched pusty, I came to a conclusion based upon evidence found in my research. You evade, you deny, you refuse to expand yourself.

Evolution doesn't explain giant humans for a simple reason. They NEVER existed. There is no fossil proof of humans of gigantic proportions.

The existence of mountains doesn't prove the flood pusty, The existence of mountains proves plate techtonics, which apparently you didn't look into either. The point isn't that mountains disprove the flood. The point is that NOTHING proves the flood. It's a story. What is a fact though is that 770 billion gallons of water proof are missing from YOUR "theory". And you can't account for them scientifically. Air pressure cannot explain away the density of 770 billion gallons of water. It can't, you don't know this because you refuse to look up the density of water vs. the volume of air. But it's ok because "some scientist" you know told you it all works out. Pusty, I am a scientist. I've got a massive background in physics, math, engineering, and chemistry. Not HS level, Not college level… post graduate studies in science. You're wrong on this friend, and I've proved it many times now, you're too stubborn to expand yourself.

Can I request a link or two please?

In bible mythology Cain and Abel had sisters. Cain married his sister, and that's why we're all retarded.

ok i have a few questions. so we havent explored this whole earth right? so what if theres more water than we know? Because we arent all knowing right? and did you add about how much water is in every human and organsim and how much is still in the air and as clouds?

how come most people here act all knowing?

Neanderphals are not extinct, us with aspergers must descend from them, we think in the same way they would have, this is why aspergers is uncommon, because there are not many descendants from our ancestors because they didnt have social skills to procreate, the world today is full of mongrels, interbreeding of different breeds, the same way if a black and white person breed they will create something brown in the middle, a new breed entirely.
But with aspergers we havent evolved from the neanderphal way of thinking.

Self correction: [Neanderthals are not extinct] The first full breed neanderthal would in fact now be extinct, but after much interbreeding, it is now a far more diluted breed.

From: http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/2978532/…
"In the human genealogy tree of evolution, Homo neanderthalensis coexisted along side our ancestors Homo sapiens, who eventually crowded out the Neanderthals because, "Genocide is one way to better the chances of your own group over competing groups.'"

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